--- Log opened Mon Jan 09 00:00:23 2006
06:33 -!- kanru2 is now known as kanru
09:34 -!- CIA-6 [i=cia@flapjack.navi.cx] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
09:36 -!- CIA-6 [i=cia@flapjack.navi.cx] has joined #nemerle
11:41 -!- m3ga [n=erikd@adsl-64-136.swiftdsl.com.au] has joined #nemerle
12:35 -!- m3ga [n=erikd@adsl-64-136.swiftdsl.com.au] has quit ["disappearing into the sunset"]
13:34 -!- NoiseEHC [n=5400ac31@lilith.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has joined #nemerle
13:34 < NoiseEHC> hi
13:35 < NoiseEHC> will nazgul be here?
13:36 < malekith> I guess so
13:36 < malekith> after 5pm
13:37 < malekith> (now it 1:36pm)
13:37 < NoiseEHC> i'm from hungary (CET too)
13:37 < malekith> OK
13:37 < NoiseEHC> thanks
13:37 < malekith> n/p
13:38 < NoiseEHC> what is the status of the generic notation?
13:38 < NoiseEHC> the wiki is a little bit unorganized...
13:39 < malekith> yeah.. it is
13:39 < malekith> anyway,
13:39 < malekith> list[int] is generic type
13:39 < malekith> list[int].Cons is a nested type of generic type
13:40 < malekith> if list had some static member, the synatax would be: list[int].static_member
13:40 < NoiseEHC> the wiki says that it conflicts with the indexer...
13:40 < malekith> for generic methods, like:
13:40 < malekith> Map.[some_type] (...)
13:40 < NoiseEHC> ahh
13:41 < NoiseEHC> so if there are no () then it would be an indexer... correct?
13:41 < malekith> but I guess it would be now possible to kill the dot also there
13:41 < malekith> this is not as easy
13:41 < malekith> since indexer can return a functional value
13:41  * NoiseEHC just started to learn
13:41 < malekith> that you can call
13:42 < malekith> for example you can have def my_array = array [fun (x) { x + 1 }, fun (x) { x + 2 }]; my_array [1] (7)
13:42 < NoiseEHC> will you stick to the [] symbols?
13:43 < malekith> yes
13:45 < NoiseEHC> so it is http://nemerle.org/Generic_specifier outdated...
13:46 < malekith> maybe a bit, it presents ideas how to solve it
13:46 < malekith> and the solution is here: http://nemerle.org/New_features#Generic_specifier
13:46 < malekith> :-)
13:46 < NoiseEHC> shall i register to edit?
13:47 < malekith> yes, we had a truck load of spam
13:47 < NoiseEHC> ok
13:48 < NoiseEHC> did you do a comparison with boo?
13:48 < NoiseEHC> i have seen a table of nemerle vs c# but it is not too hard to beat c# :)
13:49 < malekith> well, the idea is not beat C#, but to allow C# programmers to convert their code ;-)
13:49 < malekith> boo has similar table based on ours
13:49 < NoiseEHC> okay but why would anybody convert if it have not been better? :)
13:50 < NoiseEHC> so is there anything in boo what is not supported in nemerle?
13:50 < malekith> the main differences between boo and nemerle is that we do not allow dynamic typing to sneak at without notice, we have better support for metaprogramming (quotations) and compiler written in Nemerle (booc is in C#)
13:50 < malekith> otoh their seem to have bigger community... 
13:51 < malekith> otoh they seem to have bigger community... 
13:51 < malekith> NoiseEHC: all that duck typing stuff
13:52  * NoiseEHC looked at boo but ran away when they did "x = 2" and it created a new variable x...
13:52 < malekith> yes, this seems error prone
13:54 < NoiseEHC> btw what is the status of nemerle at the university? will it be used as a central research language or is it just a one time job of some people there?
13:55 < malekith> rather the second option, though I'm now using it to implement a theorem prover
13:55 < malekith> that is, if you can call 2+ years one-time-job
13:57 < NoiseEHC> ok ok, i just wanted to know wether it will be "supported" by the university...
13:57 < NoiseEHC> i mean that there will always be some student to make some progress
13:58 < NoiseEHC> imho it can be the first practical university language ever :)
13:58 < malekith> thanks
13:58 < malekith> I cannot promise it
13:58 < malekith> I will continue to work on it (or around it) during my PhD
13:59 < NoiseEHC> i always tried f# but that is closed source and its syntax is err... nonhuman :)
14:00 < NoiseEHC> hmm last question:
14:00 < NoiseEHC> did you implement c#'s select syntax with macros or only think that it is implementable?
14:01 < malekith> this System.Query select in C# 3.0 ?
14:01 < NoiseEHC> yes
14:01 < malekith> nobody implemneted it yet
14:01 < NoiseEHC> is it possible?
14:01 < malekith> bug nazgul seem to be quite confidant that it is only syntactic sugar ;-)
14:02 < malekith> so yes
14:02 < NoiseEHC> it has another feature that it also can create an eval tree
14:03 < NoiseEHC> so it can be passed to evaluation functions (for example a query->sql converter)
14:03 < NoiseEHC> or query->xpath
14:04 < malekith> yes, but it's still easy, since macros can look at the syntax tree aand create whatever they like
14:05  * NoiseEHC thinks: def tree = ["select", [fields], "from",...]
14:05 < NoiseEHC> ok
14:05 < NoiseEHC> thank for the info
14:05 < NoiseEHC> will be back around 17.00 :)
14:05 < malekith> no problem
14:05 < malekith> ok
14:05 < malekith> please what a second
14:06 < NoiseEHC> wait?
14:06 < malekith> i just wanted to check this 17:00
14:06 < malekith> but i don't have irc logs :/
14:07 < malekith> he finishes his job around 16:00 so he should be here around 17..
14:07 < malekith> ok, nevermind :)
14:07  * NoiseEHC back to work... :(
14:07  * malekith too
14:08 -!- NoiseEHC [n=5400ac31@lilith.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has quit ["CGI:IRC"]
17:59 -!- NoiseEHC [n=5400ac31@lilith.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has joined #nemerle
18:00 < NoiseEHC> hmmm
18:01 -!- nazgul` [n=d47f5f7d@lilith.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has joined #nemerle
18:01 -!- mode/#nemerle [+o nazgul`] by ChanServ
18:01 -!- NoiseEHC [n=5400ac31@lilith.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has quit [Client Quit]
18:02 < malekith> nazgul`: he has just gone
18:19 -!- NoiseEHC [n=5400ac31@lilith.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has joined #nemerle
18:19 < NoiseEHC> wow
18:19 < NoiseEHC> how workinh
18:19 < NoiseEHC> hi!
18:20 < NoiseEHC> anybody here?
18:26 <@nazgul`> hi
18:26 < NoiseEHC> i looked for you some hours ago
18:27 < NoiseEHC> wanted to ask how the visual studio integration is going
18:29 < NoiseEHC> according to the web page you are who started to write it
18:30 < NoiseEHC> i have just downloaded the VSIP package but do not want to do work what you have already done
18:30 <@nazgul`> ah, I didn't update it anymore
18:30 <@nazgul`> propbably much of the API has changed, because I was working on Beta1
18:31 < NoiseEHC> do you have some code not published in the 0.9.1 release?
18:31 <@nazgul`> and at that time it looked like in quite early stage of design
18:31 <@nazgul`> there is a special private repository with this plugin
18:32 <@nazgul`> but it was created quite long ago - against 0.2 release
18:32 < NoiseEHC> can you send it to me zipped?
18:32 <@nazgul`> if you want to try it out, I can send it to you
18:32  * NoiseEHC is a visual studio user and wanna use nemerle
18:32 <@nazgul`> ok
18:32 <@nazgul`> :)
18:32 < NoiseEHC> NoiseEHC@freemail.hu
18:33 <@nazgul`> btw, I managed to use VS project to compile Nemerle files
18:33 <@nazgul`> it required changing the MSTask used by project and no much more
18:34 < NoiseEHC> and you stopped there?
18:34 <@nazgul`> no, this is my recent experiments
18:35 <@nazgul`> I use VS to code my C#(GUI)+Nemerle current project
18:35 < NoiseEHC> does your project have syntax highlighting?
18:36 <@nazgul`> and it allows me to compile the whole project (library in Nemerle)
18:36 <@nazgul`> no, it is only the project
18:36 <@nazgul`> syntax highlight requires VSIP plugin
18:36 < NoiseEHC> ok, so you did not even started creating a VSIP plugin?
18:38 <@nazgul`> story
18:38 <@nazgul`> this is a different stroy
18:38 <@nazgul`> I created a VSIP plugin some time ago, but this work was not updated
18:39 <@nazgul`> recently I just needed something which works quickly, so I created a MSTask for Nemerle and used it in VS project
18:40 < NoiseEHC> is that mstask different from \nemerle-0.9.1\tools\msbuild-task ?
18:40 <@nazgul`> no
18:40 < NoiseEHC> ok
18:40 < NoiseEHC> so can you email me the vsip code?
18:40 <@nazgul`> yes, in a moment
18:40 < NoiseEHC> :)
18:41  * NoiseEHC just started to read about vsip so it could take some time to fix that...
18:43 <@nazgul`> ok, sent
18:44 <@nazgul`> if you have any success with it, let us know :)  I myself wonder if they changed much API in the meantime
18:44 < NoiseEHC> do you know something about the code completion code?
18:44 < NoiseEHC> this page seems rather obsolete: http://nemerle.org/Open_projects
18:45 <@nazgul`> there is a working example in ncc/testsuite/completion-playground/
18:46 <@nazgul`> the page about completion engine is indeed a little bit outdated
18:49 < NoiseEHC> not too much comments... :(
18:49 < NoiseEHC> so is it usable in #develop or monodevelop?
18:50 < NoiseEHC> (i mean the completion engine)
18:50  * NoiseEHC got the email :)
18:53 <@nazgul`> no, it is just a "proof-of-concept" implementation
18:55 < NoiseEHC> just asked because i do not want to try doing the impossible... :)
18:56 < NoiseEHC> ok i will let you know wether i can make it work :)
18:56 < NoiseEHC> thank for the info
19:07 -!- NoiseEHC [n=5400ac31@lilith.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has quit ["CGI:IRC (EOF)"]
23:29 -!- nazgul` [n=d47f5f7d@lilith.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has quit ["CGI:IRC (EOF)"]
--- Log closed Tue Jan 10 00:00:25 2006